> chat > 2001-05-12

Chat for 2001-05-12 14:00:00

rich: test
moved to room Meeting Place
changed username to Ron
Ron: Hey guy
rich: hi Ron
Ron: finally remembered
rich: you mAde it this week I see
Ron: yep
rich: way to go - get my email yesterday?
Ron: re virus?
rich: actually re virus stopper, SurfinGuard
Ron: ok. shows you how closely I read it.
Ron: wil have to go back and have a better look
rich: well, I sent out a general one about the virus too
Ron: Only recall seeing one
rich: but this was from the finjan site
Ron: ok
rich: I have downloaded SurfinGuard but haven't installed it yet
Ron: is there a Mac version?
rich: don't know, but I don't think so
Ron: Would be surprising if there was
rich: of course Macs are pretty virus-resistant anyway
Ron: Actually, my dealer here for Macintosh is of the opinion that virus protection is not required for Macs
rich: still, you use a DOSbox on line sometimes, don't you?
Ron: Don't know whether I agree with him or not
rich: Frances feels virus protection is even useful for the Amiga
Ron: My experience so far tells me he's right, but sure doesn't inspire me with confidence
rich: most vandals go for teh big obvious targets, but you never know when you'll get unlucky
Ron: Oh yes... and I have Zone Alarm on that
Ron: so I can try SurfinGuard
rich: SurfinGuard supplements both Zone Alarm and your anti-virus
Ron: well that's my dealer's whole point.....although from the reading I've done on the net, Mac users can't assume they're immune
rich: essentially it looks for apps doing things they shouldn't like writing to the registry
Ron: Even Linux users are having to be aware
Ron: sounds like a good idea
rich: well, that's an environment where everyone has to have a bit more computer knowledge than average
rich: so even if the population isn't large, the number of hackers is
Ron: yup
Ron: this week, the chief danger to my iMac has been the bloke sitting in front of it
rich: anyway you can turn it on and off - that's necessary otherwise you couldn't install new software
Ron: poor old beast is going to give up
rich: oh, Ron, what have you done to the poor thing now?
Ron: was having trouble with a bad connector on my USB Hub, and must have jarred something inside the mac
Ron: ended up zapping the OS
rich: creating bad vibes - like blue smoke?
Ron: I am, as usual, the author of my own misfortune
rich: computers, I've found, are remarkably useless without an OS
Ron: well, no smoke, but I must have generated some kind of collapsing magnetic field
Ron: 'tis true
Ron: I am becoming an old hand at installing (and re-installing ) Operating systems
rich: some things are supposed to be hot-luggable - that's supposed
rich: pluggaBLE
Ron: well that's what I thought
rich: yes, I do seem to recall you've put in a fair variety of OSs over time
Ron: trouble I have, is that I cannot really leave this particular port alone, because the little videocam, and the feed from the VCR don't like eachother. Both
Ron: are USB plugs, and it's an 'either/or' situation. So I have to plug and unplug
rich: So much for theory when it comes to practice
Ron: Has something to do with the power draw on the hub
Ron: Things are getting so complicated these days
rich: USB peripherals are supposed to be daisy-chainable - yeah, allatime
Ron: No that's SCSI
rich: USB too, from what I've read - but then, I've seen the theory
Ron: But the hub is supposed to allow you to connect 4 devices at once, and the system is supposed to be capable of handling up to 256 devices
rich: I have heard the theory only works when the items plugged together have their own power supplies
Ron: actually, you're right, because my usb mouse is connected to my keyboard, and the keyboard is connected to the hub, and the hub is connected to the computer
Ron: Now hear the word of the Lord
rich: if it doesn't work I guess it's because the devices cumulatively are trying to draw too much power from the USB cable at once
Ron: Some USB devices, (such as camera's) have to be connected directly to the computer
Ron: in the manual it said that
rich: I wonder why, and wonder if I really want to know that
Ron: but I found it's ok on the hub, as long as there's no other video device present
Ron: prob ably not Rich
Ron: I keep getting the feeling that I'm not using the iMac as Steve Jobs intended.
Ron: Think I'm supposed to be a loyal little consumer who just does wordprocessing and a few MP3's
rich: well, video devices are bandwidth hogs - maybe the cable's too narrow for two
Ron: that could be
rich: I though the iMacs were for totally manic graphics gurus
rich: think I hear Frances at the front door - brb
Ron: well, pretty much (we've got a couple in the club here) but theiMac - the way it's written up in the magazines- is supposed to be a 'consumer computer'. If you want
Ron: a real mac computer you're supposed to buy a G4
Ron: ok
Ron: The iMac is supposed to be the 'poor man's Mac
rich: yes, the G4 is the real hot rod in the family
Ron: and now even my dealer says, "well you've got an older imac" .........(followed by total silence)
rich: still, it's supposed to be great for streaming video and audio and all that sort of neat stuff
Ron: damn thing isn't even 2 years old yet
rich: older iMac???? how long have you had it, six months?
Ron: It is Rich actually. but all of that is better with DVD capability
Ron: it'll be 2 years next November
rich: OK, you've had it 18 months
Ron: I've long since decided there's no point in trying to keep up
rich: that may be obsolescent in computer years, but not obsolete - yet
Ron: well no
rich: I don't remember how long I've had my 166MMX
rich: it is teetering on the trailing edge but hasn't (quite) fallen off yet
Ron: It still all depends on what you really want to do with a computer
rich: shhh!! if I thought about that, I'd still be using the Adam exclusively
rich: actually that's unfair - the Adam won't hack it on the 'net
Ron: :)
Ron: It's still true that I have more fun with the older computers including ADAM
rich: and the more power you get, the more the opportunities expand, and the more power you lust after
Ron: I understand them better
Ron: iMac here sometimes causes me to feel stupid
rich: with the DOSbox I tend more to inchoate rage
Ron: right
Ron: really...... with them I feel at home
rich: my one consolation is that I can often see when the "experts" who set things up screwed up horribly
Ron: which tends to lend credibility to a remark once made by a Transport Canada System Administrator I used to work with
Ron: he said, "one of these days all you old DOS farts are going to die off, then I can get on with my job."
rich: that would make me a little suspicious
rich: like, he'd rather deal with folks who don't know how it should work?
Ron: suspect that was the case, yes
Ron: he used to call us "Power Users"
rich: that's revealing
Ron: most days I didn't feel like one
rich: the old bit about the expert being the one who knows one thing more?
Ron: right..... also heard, if you're a teacher and you're only 1/2 hour in front of your students, you're ok
rich: yes, it's an in-joke but not without basic truth
rich: personally I always liked to stay one lesson plan ahead
Ron: well, let's just say that my experience of computers generally is such that I tend to look under the hood hopes of finding what, I don't quite know
Ron: but it's been a real ride
Ron: that's about all you need.... one lesson plan
Ron: This afternoon I have appointments with 2 people whose computers need attention
rich: yes, poking under the hood is often informative
rich: of course mistakes can get expensive
Ron: neither will pay me a centavo, but I'll probably have fun
rich: but there's always pushpins
Ron: hey! forgot about that
rich: computers prove the couplet - a little knowledge is a dangerous thing
Ron: true
rich: do you know the second half?
Ron: no
Ron: tell me
rich: :sdrink deeply, or taste not the Pieran spring"
Ron: why have I never heard that before
Ron: not associating with the right people I guess
rich: either dive in headfirst or don't even dip a toe
Ron: oh I get the point
Ron: Sometimes I wonder what my dearly departed father (God rest his soul) would say if he could see his workshop
rich: computers are the outstanding example of that truth
rich: I have the feeling he'd understand very well
Ron: no doubt
rich: what computer ills do you have on your schedule today - besides dead OSs?
Ron: A Win 95 box that doesn't get beyond the opening screen, and another similar whose mailbox has just up and disappeared
Ron: both 'legacy' items
rich: guess you'll have to start the first one up on the step by step confirm
Ron: might be 10 minutes apiece, might be 10 hours apiece, who knows
rich: maybe with the mailbox you can find it - what's the suffix, .mbx?
Ron: I have over the past while, put together a sort of 'Doctor's medical kit' I don't leave home without it
Ron: DOS, some favoured utilities, diagnostics etc
Ron: yup. mbx
Ron: but she doesn't know that
rich: yes, utilities have their utility
rich: anyway, if the mailbox has been deleted, not sure how you find it to undelete it
Ron: comes from many occasions where I arrive at someones place only to wish I'd brought this, or that
Ron: well we'll see what's in the directories
Ron: I know approximately where it should be
rich: but how do you get teh directory to show you deleted items, even if not overwritten?
Ron: I have a utility that can set file attributes, and 'undelete' those which have not been overwritten. Then they usually show up again.
Ron: It's not much different from ADAM really.
Ron: But if they have been over written then you're pretty much hooped.
rich: yes, the neat thing about File Manager is that it shows all directory entries, deleted or not
Ron: yeah, and basicly this DM Directory manager is the DOS equivalent
rich: I have often wished there were a program half as good for DOS
Ron: It's as old as the hills, but It's a staple around here
rich: what's the "official" name and whre does one get it?
Ron: My standard response to situations where I'm unable to proceed because I don't know enough is to suggest a 'real
Ron: expert who can take it further.... but at least then my party knows what questions to ask when the 'clock' is running
rich: yes, even eliminating a few wrong answers helps when you're paying a buck a minute
Ron: OH... DM...(just looking a couple of lines up)
rich: it may also help suggest just how expert your "expert" really is
Ron: It's an old hobbyist prog. I'll send you a copy. It'll fit nicely in a file attachment
rich: runs under DOS, I assume
Ron: true
Ron: yup it runs under DOS
Ron: Ian Cottrell in Ottawa gave it to me -saying're gonna need this
rich: I am not all that comfortable in DOS, but tend to accept it when there ain't no other answer
Ron: Don't know if you ever met Ian
rich: no, although I've heard a lot about him from you and many others
Ron: he's still around I believe
Ron: he was our acknowledged CP/M guru.
rich: or maybe I did, if he was one of teh ones who came by when we were at the Computer Fair there
Ron: Only person (other than Tony M.) who I heard Guy Cousineau ask advice from
rich: Robert Mallon claims to have been in touch with him recently, if I recall
Ron: yep, he was there, so you may have met him
rich: didn't Michael get some PBBS help from him, too?
Ron: Haven't been in touch with him in several years
Ron: yes... Ian was the last 'holder of the torch' for PBBS
Ron: that would have been him
rich: by the way, have you heard anything from Guy of late?
Ron: no, not a peep. Must do something about that
Ron: I do have his mailing address
Ron: he re-married eh?
rich: I assume he hasn't just faded into the mists like Tony
rich: he did? not sure if I heard that or not
Ron: suspect so. Last I saw Guy his real interests were with CB Radio, and that surprised the hell out of me
rich: yes, I could see him with ham radio, but CB?
Ron: yes, last occasion we exchanged messages he said he'd moved south of Ottawa and had married again
Ron: exactly Rich. CB'ers don't seem to fit
rich: well, I seem to recall that his first marriage was rather unhappy
Ron: yeah, heard the same, basically from Tony
Ron: w'
Ron: Well my friend, I'm due out in 1/2 hour, so better get ready
rich: in fact I have some vague recollection of someone remarking that he should have left it long ago
rich: right, time marches on. glad you did turn up
Ron: only problem was that when Guy realized that, we began to lose his ADAM attention
Ron: he did a lot of programming for ADAM to escape that unhappy marriage
rich: yes, and after teh split he was very distracted, I heard
Ron: yup....ok Rich. See you Wed
rich: look forward to it, Ron. Bye now
Ron: later
Ron: poof
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