rich-c: test rich-c: refresh
moved to room Meeting Place
changed username to George rich-c: hello Gweorge, got your drives yet? George: Hi Rich rich-c: beginning to wonder if anyone was going to turn up George: yes, only one drive is working rich-c: they were both working well when I put them in the box - wht's the problem? George: the first one i tried spinned and i got a blank screen rich-c: it spun? you did have a tape in it, didn't you? George: i tried to load three programs on it rich-c: did you get a blue screen or a black screen?
moved to room Meeting Place George: a cyan screen
changed username to Guy B. Guy B.: Greetings!!!! rich-c: hello Guy George: Hi Guy rich-c: have a problem - one of the tape drives I sent George isn't working Guy B.: Got the new anti-virus software installed on the notebook. Guy B.: Did he install it correctly? rich-c: as long as it's a good anti-virus, Guy - one of the better freebies, isn't it? George: second one works rich-c: that's the question, Guy - he says when he tried to boot it gave a blank cyan screen Guy B.: Recheck the plugs on the other drive. You could have knocked one of them loose. rich-c: blue or black makes sense - cyan dows not rich-c: but in that case, Guy, the second one wouldn't have worked rich-c: cant figure it - had both working and timed perfectly when I sent them Guy B.: Also be sure the plugs are matched to the correct drive port. Two should be in data drive A and two in drive B rich-c: matter of fact they timed best I've seen - got them to within half a percent of perfect rich-c: wonder if he got them misaligned on the pins? George: right now i'm using a single drive in a rich-c: it's easy to get a one-pin offset when you put the plug on, especially teh shorter one rich-c: the one your using, George, that's from my shipment, right? Guy B.: Ok, I checked my Expansion 3 Adam. There are four plugs. 1A 2A, 1B 2B. The back plug should be in 1A, the other in 1B. Same for data drive two. rich-c: if he's got a drive in and working I reckon he has that figured out, Guy George: i tried to install the first one three times. i was made sure of the pins matched correctly rich-c: George, what method do you use to tell which plug goes on which pins? Guy B.: Ok, your might be right on the second possibility. A bent pin. George are there any bent pins? George: no rich-c: how do you tell which way to face the plug when you plug it in? Guy B.: Ok, that rules that out. Take the plugs for the first drive and plug them in 1A and 1B. Leave the second one unplugged. George: could something happpened in shipping Guy B.: The plugs can only go in one way. rich-c: not so, Guy, it's easy to put them in back to front Guy B.: George, try the first drive again. rich-c: and George, yes, anytime you entrust anything to the tender mercies of the Post Office, nasties can happen rich-c: but the are a lot of ways to go wrong, too, which is why I'm asking you the questions' Guy B.: Did you wrap the drives in bubble wrap? rich-c: of course George: still the second drive works in the same place i tried the first Guy B.: Just wanted to be sure. We all know how the post office handles these things. rich-c: yes, but it is very easy to mis-install a drive - and you haven't answered my questions rich-c: that cyan screen makes me VERY suspicious Guy B.: George, disconnect the plugs from the second drive and leave the plugs in the first drive and see what happens? George: i only have one drive installed Guy B.: Only one data drive, not two? George: only one at a time rich-c: we have not determined yet, Guy, whether he knows back from front or A from B on the connectors - he hasn't answered rich-c: let's find out if he knows the basics before we get carried away Guy B.: Ok, George take a look inside the Adam Console. Their should be four sockets. It should be 1A 1B, 2A 2B. Is that what it says in there? George: the slots marked a large one in first a smaller one in second a rich-c: there are no slots - there are just four sets of pins in a well George: i meant pins George: it is still clearly marked little room for error rich-c: OK, can you see inscribed in the plastic on the left the 1A-1B-2A-2B Guy was talking about? Guy B.: The three slots are the expansion cards. There should be one on the right side. Just as I described. George: yes i see the clear markings rich-c: OK do you know which connector goes on which set of pins? George: yes rich-c: how do you tell? George: the second drive is working in it rich-c: that's no answer, that could be just luck Guy B.: Ok, here's what to do next. On the data drive. There should be two cables. One on the top and one on the bottom. The bottom cable goes into 1A, the top one in 1B. rich-c: how do you tell which connector is 1A and which is 1B? rich-c: and ignore Guy, half the cables are side by side Guy B.: Rich I took a look inside my Adam and that's how they are installed. rich-c: Guy, you know teh score and I know the score - but we need to know if George knows the score and he is not answering George: first one from the back marked a holds the larger one Guy B.: I bet he is confused on what goes where. George: no Guy B.: That one goes in 1A. rich-c: OK, you have discovered that onew connector is larger than the other? George: thelarger one is in 1a Guy B.: OK, put the other in 1B. George: it is Guy B.: Ok, now turn on your Adam. rich-c: wait a minute - the A lines have one fewer pins than the B lines Guy B.: Ok, hang on. rich-c: which means that the smaller connector has to go on A Guy B.: No, the larger one goes in 1A and the smaller one in 1B. George: yes George: that is the way i have it setup rich-c: I don't have an Adam handy and can't make it to the basement - but I want a physical check on that Guy B.: One more thing. Is the drive installed with the ground screw in? rich-c: Guy, dont answer this. George, how do you tell the front from the back of the connector? rich-c: does that delay mean you're just having a look now? Guy B.: I bet he's still looking everything over. George: there is a groove on the front side of the connector rich-c: that's why I am using this approach, Guy rich-c: I need to know exactly what he doesn't know about the tricks of installation Guy B.: George, did you find what's missing? rich-c: 'I don't believe that drive is defective, I think he's just fallen into one of the traps that get the rest of us all the time Guy B.: Let's see if he finds what I think is missing. George: should i ship you the computer? rich-c: why on earth would you do that, George? rich-c: or wre you talking to Guy? Guy B.: Ok, George on the bottom right of the data drive there should be a groove. A screw goes into that groove attached to the board. Is the screw there? George: i know for a fact i installed the drives the same way rich-c: that's what we all think, George, until a drive goes wonky on us rich-c: but you still haven't even told me how you tell front from back of a connector rich-c: and I guarantee you it makes a big difference George: yes i did rich-c: then maybe I'm having a dumb night, so repeat it for me George: in fact it won't go in the wrong way i tried Guy B.: Aha! rich-c: funny - I've managed to put them in the wrong way rich-c: and how do you know it's the wrong way? George: i don't force things in rich-c: in short, you don't know what you're doing but wont admit it rich-c: there is a very easy way to tell George: only one way will go in readily rich-c: but if you're only putting in one drive, Guy, it's easy to screw up Guy B.: You can very easily. George: three times? rich-c: trust me, when it comes to screwing up, I'm an expert rich-c: yes, George, when you don't know what you're doing Guy B.: We all do it whether it's one or a thousand times. George: i'm not stupid Guy B.: No one is George. But, the best of us can screw things up from time to time. I've done it too. George: ther is a divided notch on one side Guy B.: Ok, you found the sockets. rich-c: but you still haven't let me eliminate the possibility that you put in the connector back to front rich-c: after all, even not knowing, it's an even money bet you'll get it right George: the black wire goes on the right rich-c: George, if you look at the connector, one side has a ridge along the bottom, the other is smooth George: the gray to the left George: i said that rich-c: the ridge faces the back of the computer, the smooth side faces the front Guy B.: by golly, he's got it right. George: thats the way i have it Guy B.: Make sure they are all the way in. rich-c: if you try to install a drive not knowing that and using the information, the odds are 3 - 1 you'll get it wrong George: they are firmly in rich-c: George, I you talking about the working drive you have in there now, or are you changing drives as we chat? Guy B.: OK, he's almost there. Now check the bottom right of the data drive. Is there a screw attached to it.
moved to room Meeting Place George: three screws
changed username to Ron rich-c: the one marked ground is the one that counts rich-c: Hi Ron Guy B.: Hi Ron. Welcome to Data Drive 101. Ron: Fell asleep in the Chair From Hell Ron: Hi all rich-c: does that mean you're a little creaky at the moment? Ron: Data Drive 101? George: Hi Ron Guy B.: Rich and I are helping George to get his data drive to work. Ron: Hi George rich-c: George is complaining about a drive that doesn't work, we're trying to find if he knows how to install one Ron: yes creaky....that's a good way to describe it Ron: hmmmm........been a while rich-c: we have just explained how to tell front from back on the connectors Ron: ah yes... Guy B.: Took him awhile to figure that out. rich-c: I tend to be fairly well up on data drives, but even when I'm careful they are easy to screw up Ron: You mean George, in all your years as an ADAM owner, you've never had occasion to change a data drive? rich-c: you "measure twice, cut once" and still manage to get something not quite right Ron: Wait a minute, what is there to cut? rich-c: that's a saying rather than practical instruction for drives, Ron Ron: oh ok. rich-c: like do it, check it, then check again before you commit yourself George: brb i have to check laundry Ron: my Dad used to say it all the time. He was a carpenter rich-c: that's where it comes from Ron: Same as buy high and sell low rich-c: anyway, I just shipped George two data drives; he says one works, one doesn't Guy B.: Got called to jury duty today and my group wasn't called. But at least I got a check just for being there. rich-c: not that I doubt for one minute the ability of the Post Office to commit - mechanicide? George: i'm back Ron: or was it the other way around...... today the only option is to sell low or sell not at all rich-c: and if you don't sell low you'll not sell at all because it will be delisted and worthless Ron: And where were you on the evening of the 26 between noon and 2 pm? Guy B.: George, are you ready to fire up your Adam? rich-c: huh? Ron: never mind rich-c: by the way, gentlemen, if Pam does come on, it's her birthday Ron: yesterday I bought myself another mother of all boards Guy B.: Get the candles ready! Ron: AMD Duron 1.2 Gig rich-c: graduating to a 486, Ron? Ron: must be a P4 Guy B.: Oh-oh. Now's he's faster than me. rich-c: just a Duron? and only a 1.2? rich-c: I certainly hope the price was awful right Ron: sec phone rang rich-c: for home computing a 1.2 Duron is wild overkill, actually rich-c: but around here they're so cheap the stores don't want to sell them because there's no profit in them Guy B.: Well, AMD has dropped the Duron in favor of the Athlon XP. Ron: back Ron: Hell here I was thinking I'd done a good thing rich-c: no, AMD is keeping the Duron to compete with Intel's Celeron, in fact I think the 1.2 is a very new higher speed unit Ron: total package was $314. Guy B.: You did Ron. Ron: incl case and power supply rich-c: which mothrboard and how much memory, Ron? Ron: I mean it's only about 4 times faster than anything else I've got around here Guy B.: I thought Intel is dropping the Celeron, since it wasn't selling very well. Ron: 256 Meg rich-c: like I said, overkill, more power and speed than you can ever use George: i just tried it in drive 2 Guy B.: I'm now thinking of adding a 256mb to my Athlon to bring it up to 384mb. rich-c: and is that SD RAM or DDR RAM? Ron: it says on the book....... Guy B.: Has to be SDRAM. DDR Ram is for the Athlon. Ron: PC266 Systemboard by (who the hell knows) Ron: Oh well. of I was buying what I was actually going to use, I'd be back at the 286 rich-c: if it's a 266 FSB could well use DDR RAM - remember 1.2 may be e new high speed for the Duron Guy B.: George, that data drive should be the first one. Ron: yup George: can you load programs from drive2 with ADAM? rich-c: officially, no, in practice, sometimes, George rich-c: depends on how teh boot block was written Guy B.: You can, except the supergame tapes. Ron: depends on which program(s) rich-c: Ron, how many expansion slots do you have? Ron: I see one PCI slot rich-c: ONE? Ron: rest of the stuff is on the motherboard.....incl ethernet rich-c: OK, I get the picture Ron: won't need to attach much of anything Ron: Unless I get one of them All-In-Wonder jobbies rich-c: built-in modem and AGP graphics, I assume, and sound Ron: yup.... all that Ron: I haven't put this thing together yet, except to install the CPU rich-c: what size power supply, Ron? Ron: sec Ron: haven't opened the case box yet rich-c: should be 300 with two fans rich-c: these current chips are really heat-intensive Ron: yeah, I know. Ron: Will have to fill in that detail later rich-c: some current ones have two fans on the pwoer supply, one each on CPU, graphics card and for exhaust Ron: How's George making out rich-c: no doubt he will tell us in due course Ron: I'm about to turf the vast majority of my 5-1/4 inch disks Ron: they are occupying space, and I don't use them at all any more George: second drive just started to boot smartlogo Ron: that's positive rich-c: if they're dd, reformat them and hand them out as door prizes at Adamcon - dd discs are hard to come by these days rich-c: the second drive is the one you thought wasn't working? Ron: you have any idea how much work that's gonna entail - I don't think so Guy B.: Ok, that concludes Data drive 101. Ron: still, I suppose I have a year to do it rich-c: well, you've got a few weeks yet and don't have to do them all at once rich-c: besides, you have two floppy drives, haven't you? Guy B.: Ron, how long you think it will take you to install the motherboard. Ron: oh at least, but I never use them Ron: mostly the 1.4 meg 3-1/2 on the ADAM rich-c: and there's that program from Walters that lets you use all your disc drives at once Ron: you reeally think somebody might want them? rich-c: ask George - bet he'd even pay shipping to get them George: it froze up rich-c: or maybe Fred - he isn't here tonight, but he has a floppy drive Ron: I suppose rich-c: and Geoff Oltmans was asking me about floppy drives today rich-c: you mean the program hung in loading, George? Ron: Yeah George, that's the problem, and it may not be the drive's fault Ron: Guy, just saw your last question re how long to install Guy B.: Bet it because it's looking for something in the first data drive. Ron: I have no idea. I tend to be rather slow at these things Ron: Got some help today installing the CPU because I'd never done it before Guy B.: Well, do it a step at a time is the best thing Ron. rich-c: yes, Smartlogo is an original Coleco program and they tend to be finicky about whre you boot from Ron: the rest....... just depends on how fumbly I am with small screws and spacers rich-c: boot SmartBASIC in drive 2 and when the prompt appears, you'll see it thinks it's in drive one - the capstan on 1 spins rich-c: put a Logo data tape in 1, George, and give it the ctalog command (list?) Ron: some nights are better than others Ron: think Smartbasic would be a better test, yes Ron: seem to be hung here Ron: ok there we go George: task done rich-c: OK, are we right, is the program hung because it thinks it's in drive one? Guy B.: So the drives are working correctly? George: i think my keyboard cable is loose Ron: Remember that some programs may load, but will look for a HELLO file on drive one, because that's the way they're set up Guy B.: That's easy to fix. Make sure it's plugged in securely. rich-c: maybe the tab's broken off or something and it won't stay plugged in, Guy George: i'll play with it tomorrow rich-c: well, since you have both drives working, now you can go on to other problems Guy B.: Well, folks. I got to check the e-mail. So, I'll see how Saturday goes. Otherwise, next week. Ron: anyway guys, I think I'm gonna go and start my project Ron: if you see blue smoke rising from the west..... rich-c: OK Guy, I'll try for Sat but no promises - Pam is coming over Guy B.: Wish her a Happy B-Day for me. rich-c: Ron, consider a shot on Sat if you can Ron: Pam's birthday? rich-c: will do, Guy Ron: tell her to e-mail me some cake rich-c: today, but coming here Sat - out with the girls tonite Guy B.: That goes same for me. Ok, See you all later.
Guy B. left chat session Ron: re Sat....will put a note here Rich in big bold letters rich-c: good - hope for the best Ron: ok...take care all
Ron left chat session rich-c: George, guess you'll want to go sort things out now George: i need a break rich-c: OK, if we make it, see you Saturday, otherwise next week George: ok rich-c: nite now George: nite for now
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changed username to rich-c