AdamCon.org > chat > Wed 2003-07-09

Chat for Wed 2003-07-09 20:44:57

james: hello
moved to room Meeting Place
changed username to rich-c
rich-c: hello james - good morning
rich-c: and allo Daniel, bonjour, quand tu es arrive
Daniel B moved to room Meeting Place
Daniel B: Hello :)
rich-c: comment ca va, ce soir?
Daniel B: ca va super bien
Daniel B: mais je suis un peu pressÚ
Daniel B: j'ai des photos Ó enregistrer
rich-c: vous avez trop d'affaires?
Daniel B: et j'ai dit Ó James que je lui enverrais des fichiers
Daniel B: salut James!
Daniel B: Salut Rich!
rich-c: aha - swapping photos, you and james?
Daniel B: no, it's pictures from TV: special event, IAAF : International Association Athletism Federation?
Daniel B: it was the opening ceremony
Daniel B: tonight
rich-c: do not recognize the organizational name - maybe when james comes back he can enlighten me
rich-c: was this an event held in Quebec City?
Daniel B: It's like summer Olympique games... it's a world competition.
rich-c: I confess I have not heard of it
Daniel B: http://www.iaaf.org/
Daniel B: 9 July 2003 - Sherbrooke, Canada
rich-c: OK, I will take a look at it later perhaps; my computer does not take kindly to my multitasking while in chat
moved to room Meeting Place
changed username to james
james: good morning
rich-c: ah, here's james back now - and he's twins
Daniel B: Hello James twin!
james: hello hello
james: how is everyone?
Daniel B: I'm fine!
Daniel B: Je vais bien!
rich-c: Daniel was just telling me about grabbing some photos from tv for you
james: c'est bon. merci pour tes reponse a mes messages
james: from tv?
moved to room Meeting Place
changed username to Daniel B
james: what photos?
rich-c: what's the IAAF, james?
Daniel B: I taked some picture from TV. http://www.iaaf.org/
Daniel B: it's was the opening ceremony tonight... in Sherbrooke, Canada
Daniel B: in province of Quebec
Daniel B: it's a world competition like summer games
rich-c: wait a minute - International Amateur Athletic Federatiion, perhaps?
Daniel B: no, look at the web site it's Association
Daniel B: not Amateur
rich-c: if I try moving to another site while in chat, I lose the chat connection
james: hey dan, i made a little more progress
Daniel B: James: Really?
james: rich, i've found the same thing happens so i just open new browser window
james: yeah, i'm comfortable with all the string commands now, brushed up on my c a little and started playing with icvgm
james: figured out what some of this stuff does
rich-c: right - I know teh capability is there but have really never used it, so tend to forget it
rich-c: doesn't help that I maximize the chat window so lose the main screen behind
Daniel B: James: I've done a new version of ICVGM... to be able to save not a DATA file with all pattern, , color, name, etc... but only font (specific characters pattern).
james: handy. i haven't played yet with graphics much but i'm comfortable making a title screen and compiling it into my program
Daniel B: So now, you can save your pattern as a font and use it in another DAT file.
moved to room Meeting Place
james: also comfortable with sound and i think i understand the update sound function
changed username to FredK
FredK: Hi All
james: hi fred
rich-c: Daniel, what was teh final outcome of your game collection being offered on eBay?
james: rich, how are you holding up?
Daniel B: 127$
rich-c: ah, bonsoir, Fred
FredK: Salut!!
james: that's odd that it went down in price, dan
Daniel B: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3533685692&category=3540
Daniel B: two retraction?
rich-c: since it's in Yabnkee dollars, that's not a sum to be thrown back
rich-c: james, I'm in holding pattern, biding my time till I can get teh surgeries done
moved to room Meeting Place
changed username to Guy B.
rich-c: Daniel, james, you might fill Fred in on what you are up to
Guy B.: Greetings!!!
Daniel B: Sure
FredK: Hi!
rich-c: I did get him the Hackrs Helper books and he's been using them
rich-c: hello Guy
james: xgtzx
rich-c: hello case
Daniel B: James try to learn coleco programming in C ... based on my coleco programming document
james: the ever-present m. case has spoken
Guy B.: Well seems the I have a problem with P133. It's beeping while Windows 95 is up.
james: guy, have you tried a hammer? :P
Guy B.: A Hammer??
FredK: its under the "if all else fails" section
rich-c: beeping while it's up? that is passing strange
james: repeated application of the hammer should stop the beeping
Daniel B: LOL
Guy B.: I asked a friend of mine at work. He thinks it could be the hard drive.
Guy B.: Or worse case, the motherboard.
rich-c: seems unlikely - beeps usually indicate a process going on, like the memory check at bootup
Daniel B: oh... did you add or change something in your computer (hardware)?
rich-c: personal bet: I'd guess the odds at 10:1 it's a software problem of some sort
james: sorry dan, fred, spaced out
FredK: I was up there with you!
Guy B.: The bootup goes fine. The system has been hanging more too. I even did a search, could even be the keyboard. The one I have is the one when I got that system built. It's 6 years old now.
rich-c: the P133 is the laptop, isn't it?
Guy B.: No that's the desktop. The Compaq is the notebook.
james: fred, i keep forgetting where you're from
FredK: Montreal
Daniel B: At the university, one computer (a server) sometimes beep beep beep... it was a warning because the computer want more electricity power.... the only change they do it's plug another PC in the same electric circuit.
james: cool
rich-c: I'd question whether teh P133 is worth teh investment in time, then - it's pretty valueless now
FredK: been often James?
Daniel B: adding the new PC does the beep beep problem
james: to montreal? sometimes, yeah
FredK: cool, wish I could say the same for Japan!
james: so did i hear right, rich got you the haker helper series?
FredK: yes, he did, it was like x-mas for me.....
Guy B.: Well, I'm going to run the Data Lifeguard tools on the hard drive to see if that is going. If that isn't it. Then I'll try another keyboard and see if that might be it.
rich-c: Guy, how long since you did a scandisc and defrag?
Guy B.: It's run every month.
rich-c: if you're a bit into teh month, might be worth a try
FredK: Have lots to read and learn!
rich-c: I do both weekly and notice an improvement often when I do
Guy B.: I have a program to remind me when it's due.
james: yeah, me too. been going through daniels c programming docs. think i should be able to produce a simple game soon
rich-c: I tend to just do it every Friday
rich-c: also if I have been adding a lot of new software
FredK: Wow, that is cool, I learned some C aswell, its interresting!
Guy B.: I usually run it on the weekend. But, I'll run a new backup with the Zip drive while I'm at it.
FredK: started with tutorials on the net...
james: should be fun. i'm hoping to play around with character sets and sprites etc soon
Guy B.: I got a crash course on the C language from Adamcon 13 when we did those Lego Robots with Dr D.
FredK: Long time you started James, with Dans set?
rich-c: @Guy - I have to use a spanning program even if I'm doing a compressed backup to CDs
james: about a week
Daniel B: james: did you notice some part in my text to change? to make it more easy to learn?
Daniel B: to read?
james: i'm a fast learner ;-)
FredK: James you had very good backround I believe too....
Guy B.: I have a program called My Own Backup that works with CD-RW's, Zip, Floppies and even another hard drive.
james: i found a couple things, but maybe i just haven't read the right spot yet
james: @fred, yes the background is what helps
james: @dan - i think we should explain all this business about the nmi
Daniel B: maybe it's because some part of my text is not in the right place. Let me know what to change in the text...
rich-c: @Guy, yes, I have that program
rich-c: @Guy - but felt uncomfortable with it son got a drive imaging program instead
Daniel B: nmi... I added a few lines in the annexe about nmi in the new version, but i'm sure it's not enough
james: i was a little confused because in the sample programs, there's a procedure called void nmi(void) and the only thing in the procedure was a call to update_sound
Guy B.: Works very well. I've been using it with the Athlon. I've created separate backup sets and it works great.
james: then i looked at the coleco.h file. am i right in this;
james: the coleco.h file checks to see if there's a nmi call in the file
Daniel B: hummm... if you have to look at the "coleco.h" it's because my text is not clear. :(
rich-c: @Guy - I found teh documentation ambiguous - does it create a backup or image file; they are critically different
FredK: lol
Guy B.: The program creates a Zip file. If you use the highest compression. You can get a lot backed up on the backup media. You can even use Winzip to restore certain files.
Daniel B: james, i will send you now the new version of cvprog.doc and icvgm
Daniel B: Fred: you want to copy?
Daniel B: want a copy
james: thanks, dan
FredK: Dan, that is very nice of you, is it like step by step for beginner?
Daniel B: it's not a tutorial
james: hmm. it's more a reference doc, fred
Daniel B: not really a tutorial
james: you'll need some practice in c first if you're not familiar
FredK: C not bad, but graphics not familiar!
rich-c: Guy, the key point is whether it's a backup or image file that getss zipped
Daniel B: Fred, what is your email?
rich-c: anyway, I don't use WinZip since there are programs I like better that are free
james: there are graphics functions in the coleco.h library and in dan's getput.h library. they look easy enough to use
FredK: Dan, try this one please:fred_et_sylvie_K@hotmail.com
rich-c: Fred, have you tried hotmail since they put in the new interface?
Guy B.: The directories that you selected for that particular set. For example, I've created a Documents set. This set backs up all my files in the My Documents directory which also includes the subdirectories. All the files are compressed into one Zip file.
FredK: rich, no.
rich-c: I lost my hotmail account when they did - kept getting a 404 on the password link
Daniel B: It will takes a couple of minutes because the cvprog document is now 73 pages (MS Word file).
rich-c: got onto Microsoft about it but tehy wre a lot less than helpful
Daniel B: rich? do you want a copy of my cvprog doc
Daniel B: ?
rich-c: they have somehow screwed up teh link but won't admit it - it's always the customer's fault
Daniel B: I'm ready to send the files...
rich-c: I thank you, Daniel, but do not fell I would use it - I do not program
moved to room Meeting Place
changed username to mitch
james: @dan - am i right when i say that coleco.h checks the program being compiled to see if there is nmi function?
mitch: Yo!
rich-c: greetings, oh mighty one!
mitch: at ease - smoke'em if ya got 'em
rich-c: how is life on teh wet coast today?
james: hey ron
mitch: James, good sir !
FredK: Says Axel Rose!
Guy B.: Hi Ron
FredK: Hi
james: how's the big con going?
james: :P
mitch: Hi Guy
mitch: ordered the T-shirts - ordered the banner
rich-c: Fred, Dan and james have a great programming discussion going, Ron
mitch: checked with the hotel re broadband install they had underway. Apparently it's been done
Daniel B: James: the crtcv.obj contains the header 55 AA.... with the pointers to nmi routine because the pointer to the nmi routine is in the header.
mitch: all in all....coming together
mitch: All's I gotta do now is update the ruddy web page
james: hey ron - i'm going to start making games in c for coleco.
mitch: cool James. We'll look forward to that
rich-c: ron, were you on last week when Dan told us about his gamepack selling on eBay?
mitch: yes, I think I recall seeing part of that discussion, but the phone rang, and I missed most of it
mitch: fill me in
rich-c: anyway, after two reneges, seems it sold for $127 US
mitch: no - is that right eh?
Daniel B: @james @fred: I send you an e-mail with the files.
rich-c: any further details, ask Daniel
Daniel B: the bidder winner is a canadian
james: thanks dan
mitch: ADAM Lives !!
rich-c: that's very interesting, Daniel - any idea who or where?
Daniel B: I will receive this gamepack to sign it and ship it to the winner.
Daniel B: I have his name somewhere... but i don't know where he lives
rich-c: do let us know who it is - and invite him to join us here some night!
Daniel B: @james and @fred: do you receive my e-mail?
FredK: Dan, rcvd! Merci b.
james: je le recois maintenant
Daniel B: The winner is : Rob Methot... but i don't know where he lives.
mitch: Not a familiar name
rich-c: have never heard that name in Adam circles - a classic gamer only, I guess
Daniel B: Methot ... it's a commun here
mitch: yeah, almost sounds French Canadian eh?
rich-c: you think he may be a Quebucois, then?
FredK: me thought someone else!
Daniel B: Not here in Quebec city but a town near Quebec city : Levis
FredK: not the jeans!
james: i knew a guy in high school with that last name and he was french
mitch: across the river
Daniel B: no, something I'm sure .. he's not in province of Quebec
rich-c: so it's good swimming weather - dive in and float it over to him ;-)
mitch: you'd have to dodge the marine traffic of various tonnages
Daniel B: Rob win another game on Ebay... and it was my friend the seller.
rich-c: not in Quebec? well, there are lots of francophones in NB, ON, MB as well
mitch: BC
rich-c: you're growing a francophone colony in BC now, Ron?
Daniel B: @james and @fred : unzip a-font.zip in the same directory as ICVGM212.exe ... it's more easy to load font this way
FredK: ok Dan
Daniel B: @james and @fred: the font in a-font.zip are font based on charset for commodore 64
Daniel B: http://kofler.dot.at/c64/font_01.html
Daniel B: @james and fred: You can use a text editor like notepad to edit the font files I have done for ICVGM.
mitch: sorry...damn telephone....re francophone colony....actually, here in Comox, since we have a Canadian Forces Base, the community is well represented
mitch: The have a local association to promote schooling and other local activities in French
rich-c: yes, of course wherever there is a CFB there will be a good representation
mitch: yep
rich-c: I was envisioning something more like teh Acadians or the area around Windsor in Ontario
rich-c: at the moment Frances has teh weather radio on and the forecast is in French
moved to room Meeting Place
Daniel B: who's there?
changed username to Scott
rich-c: they alternate but since Franch is a less compact language it actually gets the greater amount of air time
Daniel B: Scott!
mitch: knock knock
Scott: Hello
rich-c: hello Scott
mitch: Hi Scott
FredK: Hi
Scott: Watching Cycling -- cool stuff!
Scott: Tour de France
mitch: Tour de France?
rich-c: Tour de Francer?
mitch: How's Lance doing?
Scott: My wife's Colombian, so she was happy to hear Victor Hugo is #1
Scott: Lance is #2
mitch: aha
Scott: Overall
Scott: They're on the same team
rich-c: so soon? I thought he liked to hang back then zap everyone in the mountain stages
Scott: Team Time Trials were today
Guy B.: Scott, how are you doing?
mitch: alls' I've seen so far is the little 'mishap' they had the other day
Scott: Yeah, that's what's suprising
Scott: Good, thanks Guy
Daniel B: @james: you talked to do a japanese font for coleco. i have done the icvgm new version v2.12 to you, to let you load, edit and save font 8x8.
Scott: Thanks for helping me w/the fonts
rich-c: our big deal is the Molson Indy here this weekend
Guy B.: I'll try to get them ported over for you during the weekend.
Scott: Daniel - I also have a font program
Scott: Windows based
Scott: Am trying to finish it up
Daniel B: @scott: yeah, how's working? it's to build font to do coleco games?
Scott: Would go well with your tools
mitch: That reminds me Scott
Scott: Yes, it's for adding to Coleco Games
mitch: you sent me a message some time back looking for Font Power.....??
Scott: Right now I'm writing the subroutine for saving back to the ROM
Scott: Yes, FontPOWER fonts
Scott: Just wanted to include some fonts when I release the software
mitch: I'm not sure that I have that. Who's product was it?
Daniel B: @Scott: I do a new file format... colecovision font (extension FCV; I didn't use CVF because it's reserved for Space Drive 3)
mitch: Sol Swift?
Scott: Those are public domain
Scott: Yes, Sol Swift. FontPOWER
rich-c: I think it's one of the Walters brothers, which means it's still commercial
rich-c: I may even still have a copy in stock for sale, I'm not sure
mitch: ok.... I'll look
Scott: No FontPOWER was created by Sol Swift back in the DEI days
Daniel B: the new file format is text based where you can see HEX codes.
Scott: All his software was given to public domain
rich-c: I'll see if I have a copy
Scott: I also got permission from the late Pat Herrington to include his fonts w/my software
rich-c: really? I was never informed of that, Scott
Guy B.: Rich, Fontpower was done back in the 80's. Since he went bellyup before 1990. No one has heard a word from him.
Scott: Unfortunately, I never finished it before she passed away...
mitch: Believe there was some deal that Pat Herrington was aware of
Daniel B: @Scott: when it's done, send me an e-mail! I'm not in the adamcon mailing list.
mitch: he was required to donate. .... but I'm not completely certain
rich-c: the main point, Guy, is that Pat was Sol's "agent" in latter days
Scott: Sol more or less gave Pat permission to use his software as he saw fit
rich-c: even though the work remains copyright, she had teh authority to grant permission to use parts of it
mitch: yes, that's true
Scott: However, when he got busted for fraud, he donated his works to the public domain
Scott: A shame, really
Scott: He was very talented, spaghetti code and all
mitch: yes... he was one in a million
Scott: Would anyone have any objections with me including some of his font sets?
james: sec.. catching up
FredK: Axel said that one too..
Guy B.: That I remember Rich. I even had Pat try to help me with getting a code from one of his programs. Unfortunately, I never did get that code. So, my only choice would be just to make another copy again from the original.
mitch: What about all of the stuff the Pat produced.... Glory B, and all those?
Scott: @Daniel: My program was written with Visual Basic, so it's not portable :(
Daniel B: My tool is in VB too!
Guy B.: Rich, wasn't there something about that?
Scott: I'd love to include Pat's work, and even though she gave me permission, I feel like I need to start over again
Scott: And ask her family for permission
Scott: Really? Your tool is VB?
Scott: VB6 or VB.Net?
mitch: brb
Daniel B: of course... ICVGM is in VB and it's a very good spagetti code :)
Daniel B: it's VB 5...
Scott: Wow, VB5...
Guy B.: I have VB 4
Scott: I'm using VB6
Scott: I have VB.Net, but haven't used it yet
moved to room Meeting Place
changed username to Pamela
Guy B.: My Dcopy32 setup was written in VB4.
rich-c: greetings, daughter
Pamela: Phew, made it finally
rich-c: where have you been?
Guy B.: Pam, lonng time no see. How are you doing?
Pamela: out playing with the newlyweds : )
Scott: I have some questions for you as to how you opened a program outside of VB
Daniel B: I don't think .NET technology will help use in our tool development
Daniel B: help us... not help use
Scott: For classic gaming, not initially
FredK: Hi Pam, good night too, goto get going, Merci Dan fr e-mail, to all good night!!
rich-c: so how are Art and Kim settling in?
Scott: I'd love to build a collaborative tool for ColecoVision programmers
Pamela: Hi, Fred, sorry I'm late - nice to see you
rich-c: bonsoir, Fred, see you next week
Scott: Where programmers can collaborate on a software project
Pamela: Seem fine to me Dad - they say hi, by the way
FredK left chat session
Scott: In that case, it would be useful
Daniel B: Fred: good night!
rich-c: good - I was over to Speedy today
Pamela: oh? to get your rattle fixed?
james: i have to go for a bit but i'll be back
Guy B.: He disappeared quickly, didn't he?
rich-c: yes - a bit over $200 worth
Pamela: ouch! You're entitled to a 25% discount as my relatives, Dad
mitch: back
Pamela: Did you go to Dufferin and Lawrence?
mitch: Hi Pamela
Pamela: Hi, Ron
Daniel B: @Scott: I admit that I never think about that. I always build my own tools when I can't find a tool I need.
Scott: Daniel - I have a Diagram I put together in Visio that maps out the functionality of the tool
rich-c: the pipe rusted off teh muffler - or more to teh point, the joint on the muffler itself rusted out
Scott: Will send
Scott: I am almost done with the tool itself
Scott: Need about 2 weeks
Scott: To finish.
rich-c: yes, I took it to Marcello - didn't know about teh discount
Daniel B: 2 weeks? too short... take your time! :D
rich-c: I did have the old somebody card for 15% though
Scott: Took this last week off programming - 4th of July
Pamela: well that helped a little, anyway.
Scott: I'm almost done with the base functionality
Scott: So that's about what I need
Scott: Will continue to add more functionality as I move along
rich-c: he did recognize me, by the way
mitch: "functionality" arrrrghhh !! a word that should be stripped from the English language
Scott: Daniel - Can you have multiple font sets open at the same time
Pamela: Guy, to answer your question, two weeks ago was a date with my inlaws for dinner, and last week we were on vacation at the trailer so I've been noticeably absent
Scott: More enhancements
rich-c: it's OK, I've been sending him his diet Coke for you, Pam ;-)
Scott: Playing Parasite Eve II on Playstation
Pamela: tonite, I was at Kimberly's parents with Kimberly and Art and her two godchildren - we were playing croquet and volleyball and dodgeball - I'm wiped!
Daniel B: @Scott: Adding more font for ICVGM is what I have done yesturday.
Pamela: thanks Dad
(Guy B. gives Pamela a can of Diet Coke.)
Pamela: Ahhhhh!
Daniel B: @Scott: I do a new file format for the font files
Scott: Neat. Curious what you'll think about my tool
rich-c: I'll bet you're wiped - it was just a trifle warm for high activity this evening
Scott: Cool. I am also creating a file format
Pamela: actually, it's beautiful out - but the mosquitos thought I was a prime target
Scott: Will add support for your font sets
mitch: that's the trouble with file formats - there are so many to choose from
mitch: standards.... not file formats
mitch: same thing
rich-c: beautiful if you aren't running around - but mosquitos are a serious danger this year
Guy B.: Finally cooled off here. But, we have been getting storms since the 3rd of July and it might finally end on Friday.
Daniel B: @Scott: You can edit the pattern table of your project then want to change the font, just just have to select it and he will take place over your pattern table to replace the most commun characters "A-Z", "0-9", etc... depends on what is coded in the font file.
Pamela: well, I avoided most of them - outran them, I think!
Scott: My specification is a text file proprietary format, not binary so it can be edited outside the program
rich-c: yes, Guy, there have been a series of fronts coming through, alternating sun and showers
moved to room Meeting Place
changed username to BobS
Daniel B: @Scott: I have more than one tool: ICVGM and CVPAINT
Pamela: Hey, Bob, I was just wondering where you were
Daniel B: @Scott: ICVGM tool is based on DAT files generated with CVEDITOR by John Dondzila. ICVGM was first for DOS and after for Windows.
mitch: People used to use the hight bit character set to play around wiht
rich-c: geez, Robert, about time you showed up - where have you been?
mitch: with
BobS: howdy guys and gals
mitch: Well Hey.... the crowd is complete
Pamela: gal singular, Bob
Daniel B: @Scott: CVPAINT is more like a bitmap editor
Guy B.: Well, there he is. Bob, I've sent my last payment to you. Should get it by the weekend.
BobS: been to son in laws birthday party
Scott: I played with your Paint Program
Scott: Sure
BobS: COOl Guy
rich-c: oh, well I guess that's a reasonable excuse ;-)
Daniel B: james show me a bug in my cvpaint program
Guy B.: Now my airline reservations this weekend. Ron, I'll send you an e-mail on that once I've got it booked.
Daniel B: showed... and i fixed the bug
mitch: please Guy..... will come pick ya up
Pamela: where's Judy?
BobS: OH Ronald BTW, what were "we" going to do as a session for convention??????????????????Judy sittign right here
mitch: Bob....got a question for ya
Pamela: Hi, Judy!
BobS: tradin questions eh???????
rich-c: Bob, how's the ticker timing testing going?
BobS: "tell Pam HI" she says
Daniel B: I used a string to load the binary code... doesn't work with japanese windows... i changed for array of bytes
Pamela: thank you!
Guy B.: My session will be a review of the AdamEm utilities. So, I'll reprint the docs that I did two years ago.
BobS: did the stress test good, didn;t kick off
Pamela: theres good news!
mitch: oh..... yours first. I'm not sure we got that far.... but was going to suggest a down and dirty demo on file transfers.... of the kind we annually have trouble with
Guy B.: That's great to hear.
rich-c: well, that's a good start anyway!
BobS: thta is what I thought we goin g to do
Daniel B: @James : it's time for lunch! :D
mitch: Only this time, it's going to work, right?
BobS: AFTER convention they may try the paddle defibulator thing
Guy B.: Bob, have you been getting a lot of stormy weather by you?
BobS: RIGHT
Pamela: it's all in how you hold your tongue in your cheek, Ron
Daniel B: @scott: i found many Commodore 64 font
BobS: actually Guy we have missed most of the severe stuff the last few days as it went south of us
Daniel B: http://kofler.dot.at/c64/font_01.html
Guy B.: And you sent it right to ME!
mitch: now.... my question..... re the T-shirt for Jeffie (Wick the younger).... my supplier tells me it won't be possible to do one in the
Daniel B: @Scott: I started to convert into font files for ICVGM
rich-c: yes, the stuff has been dodging around Toronto too when it's blown over this way
mitch: requested infants size.... was just talking to Dale (phone) and he said you did something different
BobS: went to court today for Ryan's injuries.
james: back
Guy B.: How did it go?
BobS: the sob only got 1 year in county jail and 3 yrs probation
james: what did i miss?
rich-c: bummer
moved to room Meeting Place
Guy B.: Crap, he should have gotten more.
left chat session
Pamela: that sucks - why aren't they harder on these guys?
Daniel B: I'm looking for charset in classic arcade games like pacman.
mitch: very light sentence
BobS: DIFFERENT???????? oh yea, couldn't fit the whole thing on the tiny tshirt so had to cut some out
BobS: think it didn't have th3e graphics just the AC14 part
mitch: ok.... will suggest that to my guy here
Daniel B: I used a similar charset as the one in pacman arcade game in my dacman game
Pamela: James, lots of technobabble
Scott: I have discovered the font sets
Guy B.: Wacka, wacka!
Pamela: how is Case, James?
james: case is fussy
rich-c: absolutely, Pam - they're actually talking Adam stuff!
mitch: that's what fathers are for....
mitch: to be fussy at
james: psychology of a 1 yr old "i, my, me"
(Guy B. gives BobS a can of Diet Coke.)
Guy B.: I'm being generous tonight.
Pamela: well at least you've got that part down pat
BobS: thanks Guy
mitch: fling one over the Rockies Guy
Daniel B: be .. right .. back
(Guy B. gives mitch a can of Diet Coke.)
mitch: maybe it'll hit Vancouver Isl.
Guy B.: At the speed of light.
Pamela: ewww, messy
mitch: missed.. it's out in the Pacific somewhere
james: i was hoping to play with making a japanese font tonight, dan
rich-c: maybe it will float over to james
(Guy B. throws a hot potato at mitch.)
Pamela: mmm, Coke floats
Guy B.: Did you catch that?
mitch: oh my GoD !!!
mitch: Pamela, I can't believe you said that
james: @pam, i know of a few other things that float too :P
BobS: Ron, told me once but ya know.......HOW LONG to get from you to the ferry to the mainland??????
Pamela: I know, it was a terrible pun - blame it on my recent extended exposure to Russell
mitch: ouch
Guy B.: I guess that missed too. Ron, your losing your touch.
mitch: square on the forhead
Pamela: at least hot potatoes go squish and not clunk, Ron
mitch: indeed
Scott: Sorry, I'm still here, just checking out the fonts
rich-c: depends on which ferry to whre on the mainland, doesn't it?
Pamela: there's a beautiful breeze coming in the window
james: vancouver isn't a wayward province.. yet :P
BobS: think we were going to goto duke point from south of comox
Guy B.: How's the weather out there by you Ron?
mitch: (technobabble on) @Scott @Daniel.... ok guys, so now if you're going to re-do VRAM, given there is only a finite amount of space there, how many character sets do you thing you could load at once?
rich-c: Ron, am I right that ferries run Tswassan/Schwartz Bay or Nanimo, and North Vancouver ditto?
mitch: could you swap characters in and out of the name table?
Pamela: hey Guy, how's your love life?
mitch: not quite Rich. the first part is right, but the North Vancouver run arrives at Departure Bay. The Twawwassen/Nanaimo run arrives at Duke point, 10-15 km south of Nanaimo
Guy B.: Pam, got to tell some news on that. Looks like Aimee and I are going to give it another try.
Pamela: Good!
mitch: Duke Point is south of Nanaimo
Guy B.: As of for Marsha. That's another story I have to you myself.
mitch: coming from Duke point, you actually end up bypassing the city of Nanaimo on the Inland Island highway
Daniel B: ... ok, I'm back... and i don't know how many charset could be in VRAM, depens which screen mode you want to use
Pamela: was it a disaster?
Scott: For a game that fits into a 32K ROM, you're better off with only one character set (in addition to the set in OS7)
james: dan - i was thinking
mitch: ok. which is why you seldom ever see more than one
james: (that happens sometimes)
Guy B.: Well, let's say it was a bit of a surprise. I already told the guys about it. They told me to run.
Pamela: darn, James, beat me to the punch
james: yeah, saw it coming :P
mitch: thinking - what's that?
Pamela: well, that's probably good advice
Scott: You can also store graphics in font sets as 8x8 tiles
Guy B.: Are you ready?
Pamela: that's the white noise going on in the back of your head, Ron
james: i think that's when you get pictures in your mind accompanied by a headache :P
Pamela: Go
Daniel B: With screen mode 2... you can use up to 3 charset at the same time, one charset per 8 lines on screen.
Scott: Depends on how you want to use them
mitch: oh that's what that is
Guy B.: Marsha is still married, but separated.
Pamela: and . . .
Scott: The fonts look great in Daniel's Gamepack
mitch: Ron is still married but separated
Guy B.: She's even fallen in love with me.
james: james is still married and nowhere near separated :P
Pamela: ???
rich-c: well, that's the story you wre given
mitch: you don't wanna go there James
james: lol
Daniel B: @Scott: it's a little better version of the default COMMODORE 64 charset
Daniel B: I used in gamepack
mitch: `
Guy B.: Pam, it's sort of complecated. But, she wants to get out of the marriage. She's not happy.
Scott: These font sets are great, Daniel
Scott: These are 8X8 font sets?
Pamela: And she's using you as an excuse to dump the husband?
mitch: (mitch shakes cookie crumbs from his IBM keyboard)
BobS: run Guy run.........you don't need to be amarriage breaker upper
Daniel B: the one in gamepack or the ones in the web site kofler.dat.at/c64 ?
Guy B.: No, she's not. There's a pre-nup agreement involved.
rich-c: do that too often, Ron, and you'll have to take it into teh shower with you
Scott: That's the site I'm at
Pamela: they're right. Run.
Scott: Tons of fonts
Scott: Thanks
Scott: Are these copyrighted?
Guy B.: I already got that advice Pam. Right now, I'm not even seeing her.
mitch: :)
Daniel B: Most of the charset in the web site are 8x8 .. but some of them are 16x8, 8x16 or 16x16...
BobS: a keyboard in the shower wid ya........a wee novel idea'r
Daniel B: Most of them are copyrighted
Pamela: Good. That kind of complication you don't need.
Scott: Do you know which aren't
rich-c: apparently most parts of a current computer can be washed
Daniel B: i have no idea... but this will not stop me to produce font files for icvgm based on these fonts
Pamela: it's the blowdrying afterward that takes so long
Guy B.: I already told her what she needs to do. I think she will do what's right for herself.
Scott: Well, users can download from this area
mitch: I don't know about that. My final act as am employee of Her Majesty was to dump a cup of coffey on my keyboard
rich-c: I'd say assume any that actually came with a computer or commercial program still are, Scott
mitch: It did not survive
Pamela: was that intentional, Ron?
mitch: coffey...coffee.....coyfie
mitch: something like that with sugar in it
Guy B.: Kaffee in German.
Daniel B: @scott: the particularity of the c64 charset is that the character is the character number 1 not 65.
mitch: no..... but the boss did not believe me
rich-c: did you try washing it out, Ron?
Daniel B: it's why I have to adapt to the coleco ascii code
Pamela: gee, I can't imagine why : )
BobS: and a swirly in the loo is NOT the way to clean the board
Scott: Hmmm... Interesting
mitch: Nope...just substituted it with another from the desk of one I knew was on holiday
Scott: What does the file structure look like?
Guy B.: Be right back.
Guy B. left chat session
BobS: good one!!!!!!1
moved to room Meeting Place
changed username to Guy B.
Daniel B: the file 64c? or FCV?
mitch: I do have an 8 pm meet, people, so I must go
mitch: be all of you well and good
Guy B.: Lost the rest of the log.
Pamela: aw
BobS: well bummer dude
Pamela: gnite Ron
Guy B.: Bye Ron.
Pamela: be poofy
Daniel B: bye ron
mitch: ker..... p o o f
rich-c: c'est la vie, Ron - be good, see you next week
mitch left chat session
Guy B.: I should be going too. I'll see how Saturday looks. Otherwise next week.
Daniel B: The file 64c start with a pointer to the memory address 3800. After it's the charset
Daniel B: it's a binary file
rich-c: OK Guy, I may or may not be on. likely will
Pamela: sheesh, I just got here and everyone is leaving : (
rich-c: that's what you get for coming late
james: i gotta go
Pamela: Nite, Guy. good luck with Aimee
Guy B.: Well, some of us DO have to get up Early for work.
Guy B.: Thanks Pam.
Guy B.: Ok, Bye, POOF!
Pamela: yvw
Guy B. left chat session
james: i gotta go too
rich-c: nite then james - btw, we wren't participating but were taking in the crosstalk
Daniel B: The file FCV is my personal font file format. it's a text file. Start with a header with the name of the font. the following lines are the data for the pattern
BobS: nite james
Pamela: hi to everyone James, and a kiss for Case the Fussy
Daniel B: james: lunch time?
james: bye all. will do
james: @dan, i have to get to my other job.
Daniel B: ok! bye James!
james: but i'll be on again tonight. hope to make a japanese set and try loading it into my game
Pamela: nite
Daniel B: I hope too
rich-c: wonder what a new Japanese game pack would sell for?
james: i was also thinking dan that we should write a "general approach" to making games
Daniel B: @Scott: gove me your email address. I will send you my icvgm v2.12 with some fonts
james: lol rich - hopefully we'll find out :P
Daniel B: gove?.. give!
Daniel B: why i is so close to o
james: lol
Daniel B: see you later James!
Pamela: to cause as much trouble as possible, Dan
james: will talk to you tonight hopefully ! bye! (^o^)/~
rich-c: actually that's true, Pam - the purpose of teh qwerty keyboard is to slow typing down
Pamela: I know the history Dad
james: *poof*
rich-c: tho0ught you might
Pamela: bye James
Daniel B: @scott: what is your email? I want to send you my icvgm tool
james left chat session
rich-c: Bob, did you ever get your answer about the ferries?
Pamela: Hello?
Pamela: okay, I showed up
rich-c: I guess Bob and Scott are off scouting eBay or something
Pamela: guess so
rich-c: I'll see if I can wake up Bob
Pamela: I'll be MIA again next Wednesday
rich-c: haircut or new tv program?
Pamela: haircut night
Pamela: however, after that it should be six weeks of peaceful Wednesdays
rich-c: maybe you should switch to a different night or at least different time
Pamela: can't because of Emily's and Russell's schedules
BobS: i's here
BobS: was looking at yahoo auction
rich-c: bout time, Bob. did you get your answer on the ferries?
Pamela: used to do it Tuesdays but Em only works Wed, Fri and Sat now
Daniel B: Be right Back...
BobS: more or less......i got it somehwere in an old email i will have to dig up AND then get out the maps
BobS: this time I AM going to make reservations. got skinked going and comning back last time
Scott: Sorry
Scott: I'm back
rich-c: OK - be aware that there are two departure points and two arrival points - four choices
Scott: Downloading all the fonts I can get a hold of
Scott: Tons of fonts, yay!
BobS: I know, want southern for getting on the island and northern ones to get back
Scott: @Daniel: My e-mail address is sctegordon@aol.com
rich-c: you'd better get on the BC ferries website and decide which you want
Scott: Looks like I just missed him
Pamela: he'll be back Scott
Scott: brb
rich-c: OK, southern is Tswassan, right down on teh 49th parallel
BobS: i know, should this week or next before we go to traverse city for the weekend
BobS: then we will be ready to go for AC15
Pamela: well gentlemen, I think I shall retire
BobS: think Schartz Bay to Tswassan
rich-c: it goes to Schwartz Bay north of Victoria, or one of teh Nanaimo destinations (either Duke Point or Departure Bay)
BobS: then Naniomo to Duke Point on way back after convention
rich-c: OK Pam, see you and Russell on Tuesday, then
Pamela: all that running around wore me out
BobS: be good Pam
Pamela: yes Dad, and I may see / talk to you on the weekend
BobS: got to go here to, long day and tired out
Pamela: Thanks Bob, I try
BobS: see ya all next WEd.....on time ???????
rich-c: Duke Point and Departure Bay are both near Nanaimo on teh island
Pamela: I'll be MIA next Wed most likely
Scott: Too many good fonts
BobS: hmmmmmm
rich-c: your mainland options are North Vancouver or Tswassan
Scott: Too little time
Pamela: clear sailing after that though Bob
BobS: ok
BobS left chat session
rich-c: night Pam
Pamela: Well, that was quick. Okay, I'm outta here. Tell Daniel I said goodnight. G'nite Dad, good nite Scott
Scott: US has a good cycling team
Scott: Night
Pamela: kerplunk
Pamela left chat session
rich-c: time for teh old folks to clock out too - I'll leave you and Daniel to chat, Scott
Daniel B: I'm back...
Daniel B: @Scott: I send you by e-mail ICVGM
Scott: Ok
Daniel B: nite pam!
Scott: you're back
Scott: Email: sctegordon@aol.com
rich-c: OK, colour me gone
rich-c left chat session
Daniel B: I must have received my email now
Daniel B: you must.. not I
Daniel B: it's late... :)
Scott: Oh no!
Scott: Everyone gone
Scott: Well, I will make sure my program can read all these fonts
Scott: Good stuff
Daniel B: you will find easy this file format
Scott: Great
Scott: I will send you my program once it's farther along
Scott: Right now you can edit the font set
Daniel B: you may have to include an "Import" in your own tool but it's not a complicated format.
Scott: You can extract it from the os7 and smartwriter roms
Daniel B: no, I extracted the font from the c64 site.
Daniel B: I can extract the font from the OS7
Scott: You can extract the font sets from the OS7 and SmartWRITER ROMs
Daniel B: i didn't do it
Scott: Yeah, it's easy
Scott: The program knows the offsets, so it can load it on its own
Scott: So far you can edit, apply filters, but only for 8X8 font sets
Daniel B: I will adapt my program I do to read the 64c files to be able to extract font 8x8 from any binary files.
Daniel B: Yes, I wanted to add a "offset" if my program detect it's not a 64c file.
Scott: My program is an MDI Parent/Child format
Scott: You can open multiple font sets, cut and paste between them, etc
Daniel B: my 64c2fcv program is a bit intelligent. it places the right patterns for the A-Z at the right place for the coleco font.
Scott: But I am still working out the kinks
Scott: Cool
Daniel B: your tool sounds great.
Scott: I've never used Commodore fonts, so I have plenty to learn
Scott: And they look great
Scott: I think you could get value out of my program
Scott: And you're welcome to include it with your tools
Scott: You can also export the patterns to assembly code
Daniel B: There are so many software for Commodore 64 named "writer" and they came with some charsets...
Scott: So you can cut and paste the code directly into your programs
Scott: Also would like to create the "C" code to include in C programs
Daniel B: the goal of my icvgm tool is to export in ASM or C format the pattern, color, etc... to build coleco project easilly
Scott: If someone doesn't want to include as a separate file
Scott: Cool
Scott: I used your C tools
Scott: Worked great
Scott: I created a simple ROM from your test program
Scott: The instructions were at first a little confusing
Scott: Didn't realize that you were actually sending data to the clipboard
Daniel B: You may want my cv prog doc... i have done a new version with 2 more pages about VDP.
Scott: Once I understood that, no problemo
Scott: Yeah, great
Scott: I have a document that I also started last winter
Scott: Has some stuff that could be included in your documentation
Scott: Also plenty about the VDP
Scott: I made some edits to your instructions
Scott: Just so I wouldn't forget what I did
Daniel B: i know that my tools and my programming doc are not perfect but they helped new coleco programmers like james
Scott: Didn't know James was programming
Scott: That's good
Scott: If you want to see the edits, I could send them to you
Daniel B: the first thing James tried was teh SSHOW program from my coleco web site. he used BMP2PP by MArcelde Kogel to convert a picture of his son Case
Scott: I don't remember the name of the tool, though
Scott: I've used that tool BMP2PP, good stuff
Scott: Works great
Scott: One of the programs that I want to write is a tile editor
Scott: That would integrate a picture program with environment mapping
Scott: But first I have to finish my Font program
Daniel B: a tile editor? like what i have done in ICVGM?
Scott: Have you done this already?
Daniel B: what do you mean by tile editor?
Scott: Will have to take a look
Scott: An image, say 16X16 or 8X8 that is printed multiple times on the screen to make a picture
Scott: Most RPGs (old RPGs) used tiles
Scott: To create water, grass, etc.
Daniel B: icvgm has a screen editor where you can put characters on it (on screen).
Scott: A tiling engine with an environment map
Scott: Is it limited to 8X8
Scott: The game I am working on uses 16X16
Scott: But I need better tools in order to finish it
Scott: Have you received your carts yet?
Daniel B: yeah, icvgm is based on characters (8x8) not group of characters....
Scott: Err, have you played them yet?
Scott: Tiles, in my definition, can be made of multiple 8X8 images
Daniel B: no, i didn't play them... but i'm sure they are working.
Scott: To create groups of tiles, or objects
Scott: That's a shame you haven't played it yet
Scott: It's really cool seeing your game on the actual system
Daniel B: no time to play... I had so many requests
Scott: Do you have a ColecoVision
Daniel B: and many things to do.
Scott: Do you have the boxes and instructions?
Scott: The boxes look great
Daniel B: I have many colecovision but only one is working perfectly
Scott: A French ColecoVision?
Scott: CBS Electronics?
Daniel B: I have the box and manual.. the manual re-used the same text as my manual version
Scott: Or US Model?
Scott: What do you think of the boxes and instructions?
Daniel B: I live in Canada... It's a North Americain ColecoVision. not CBS one.
Scott: I thought it looked very professional
Scott: Or are you unhappy with how it turned out?
Daniel B: it look professional ... but the box quality seems poor, easy to scrap.
Daniel B: it's why I prefer a good VHS shell
Scott: I agree.
Scott: For my release, I want plastic
Scott: Something that will last
Daniel B: Albert Y. (from atariage?) want to release coleco games too.
Scott: I bought some BlockBuster plastic casings on Ebay
Scott: I have about 20
Daniel B: and they will use VHS shell
Scott: These were the cases used for SNES/Genesis
Daniel B: your idea sounds great
Scott: Can be used for Coleco, no problem
Scott: Want to get more
Scott: Cost about $1 each
Scott: All we need to do is print the insert
Scott: and you have your box
Daniel B: a standard VHS sheel is about 0.33$ each
Scott: They're a strange size though, and to tabs for the heads is annoying
Scott: Of course, the inside of these game cases don't hold the cartridge in place
Daniel B: yeah... but it works
Scott: It's looks a little funny, though
Scott: If we could find something like a Sega Genesis case
Scott: That holds the EA games (about the same size as a Coleco Cart), then we'd be set
Scott: I bet if we shopped around we could find something
Scott: Something sleeker than a VHS case that can hold a cartridge
Scott: Well, I don't want to keep you up all night
Daniel B: if you don't try to shake it during hours... the cartridge will stay top shape in the VHS case.
Scott: Will keep in touch via e-mail until I can send you the program
Scott: Yeah, I don't like the idea of doing boxes
Scott: Cardboard boxes get destroyed fast
Daniel B: exact
Scott: And you can't clean them
Daniel B: exact again!
Scott: The box your game came in looks nice, but won't last very long
Scott: And at $10 each, it's just not worth it
Scott: Imagine what kind of plastic case we could get for $5 each
Scott: Or a lot less
Scott: And we could do a full color manual instead
Scott: And it still would cost a heck of a lot cheaper
Scott: How much did your copy on Ebay sell for?
Scott: Last I looked it was $178
Daniel B: it was Micheal idea... he wanted so much...
Scott: Yeah, he had good intentions
Daniel B: on Ebay? some retractions
Scott: But as a developer, I wouldn't have done it that way
Scott: Yeah, Mike was auctioning a single copy on Ebay
Scott: The rest will be released at the Classic Gaming Expo
Daniel B: yeah... but he try to seel more than one now
Scott: Did the auction close?
Daniel B: he want to sell another want now to one of the other bider
Scott: Just curious what the winning bid was
Scott: What do you think?
Daniel B: the auction close ... the winner was a canadian : Rob Methot. for 127$
Scott: How is that working? Are you splitting profits?
Scott: Hopefully you are
Daniel B: He said it's to gain more profit, I said he will have more difficulties to sell a number 2 or 3 / 50
Daniel B: he splited...
Scott: Good, so you'll actually make good money off that copy
Scott: Like $50?
Daniel B: To reach 5$ per cartridge, I accepted to have only 20% from the cartridge sold with ebay
Scott: Maybe we should sell all of these via Ebay
Scott: Or you should sell...
Daniel B: Micheal will disagree to let me shell the game. he want to make profit first
Daniel B: he paid so much for the box...
Scott: Do you have any plans to release your other ROMs as cartridges
Scott: Yes, too much
Scott: Lessons learned
Scott: My favorite is the Halloween ROM you created
Scott: It's like a mini game
Scott: But I really liked it
Daniel B: some guys think I'm making money with gamepack .... I make more money with Ms Space Fury.
Scott: Really? That was a Digital Press release, right
Scott: What killed the profits were the boxes
Scott: They looked nice, but not practical
Daniel B: Halloween... Jeepers Creepers is the full version... still buggy for the title screen and some friends suggest me to modify the end of the game.
Scott: How many games did you distribute through Digital Press
Scott: Any interest in revisiting that?
Scott: I would love to see a cartridge of this
Scott: Of the stuff you put together, this was my favorite
Scott: Of course, I haven't seen everything you've done
Daniel B: I do ms space fury for digitalpress10th anniversary ... they pay me about 20$ per cartridge... maybe more.
Scott: Wow, that's great
Scott: That's the way it should be
Daniel B: yeah!
Scott: Did they release just the cartridge or what
Scott: Any instructions?
Scott: VHS case for a box?
Daniel B: there was no manual and box ... but they do posters and little magnet with the image of the poster
Daniel B: no, there was a manual
Scott: I would rather have my release in some type of enclosure, even a plastic VHS case
Daniel B: a manual who looks like a normal coleco manual
Scott: Manual is optional
Daniel B: but B&W
Scott: Sometimes a one page insert is good enough
Scott: These games are fairly simple
Daniel B: a one page.. that's a sheet of paper... I write instructions on a sheet of paper for dacman and bustin-out
Daniel B: gamepack is not only a game, it's more than ten games... it's normal to have a manual with more than 2 or 4 pages.
Scott: Sure, Gamepack is an exception
Scott: Any plans to make a Gamepack II?
Daniel B: yeah.
Scott: Thought I heard you might consider it if this release goes well
Scott: That's great
Daniel B: You must contact coleco programmers to help you with your tools.
Scott: Me?
Scott: Sure.
Daniel B: Yeah! Subscribe to: http://groups.yahoo.com/groups/colecoprogramming
Scott: Didn't know it existed
Scott: How many programmers do we have?
Daniel B: I think there are more than 3 or 4... because some guys don't post in the forum but are interrested in coleco programming
Scott: I've been writing the game Dragon Master on and off for the past 10 years
Scott: For ColecoVision
Scott: and/or Coleco ADAM
Daniel B: You program in ASM... using which compiler?
Scott: TASM
Daniel B: like Norman Nithman
Scott: In TDOS I was using z80asm
Scott: I've got more college ahead of me and will probably eventually write my own compiler
Scott: I would definitely like to learn how to write an emulator as well
Scott: There's actually some classes at the University of Colorado at Boulder where I could do this
Scott: I was also thinking about doing this game for Game Gear
Daniel B: I also wanted to adapt the colecovision part of ADAMEM to do an emulator for Windows to replace VirtualColeco to test my projects... and also to add it into the toolkit.
Scott: Yeah, I would like to integrate the emulator with my Font Editor and create a complete development environment
Scott: But of course that's a lot of work and not a lot of time with wife and school and work
Scott: My wife helped solder all of the boards for your game
Scott: Her name is Ligia
Scott: Colombian woman
Daniel B: thank her for me!
Scott: She said the hardest part was removing the cartridge labels
Scott: That was a big pain!
Scott: She says you're welcome
Scott: Actually, she said de nada
Scott: Whatever the heck that means, right
Daniel B: yeah! it's not easy... one guy here find a way to completly remove the label without scrtching the cartridge
Scott: Not like I actually understand what she says
Daniel B: i don't know his secret
Scott: We used all types of stuff
Scott: But on some the glue was so old it bonded with the plastic
Scott: For every 5 there was 1 like this
Scott: Some came off real easy
Scott: Just kidding about my wife
Scott: I like to give her a hard time
Daniel B: i think it's time to quit... it's late! nice to talk with you
Scott: Yeah, I gotta work in the morn
Scott: Will stop by next Wed
Scott: Otherwise, I'll e-mail you
Scott: Bye
Scott left chat session
moved to room Meeting Place
changed username to rich-c

AdamCon.org > chat > Wed 2003-07-09
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